A Journey in Community Action | Linda Huntspon, CAASTLC & Rob Symes

0:02Hello everyone and welcome to the Forel podcast. I'm joined by Linda Huntsman from Castle, the executive director of Castle out in the great state of Missouri in St. Louis. But um Linda, thanks so much for joining us. I'd love to start with just a little bit about your background, a little bit about you, and then how you got into community action. >> Well, thank you for having me. It's it's honored to be on your podcast. I have been is in social service or serving our community for well over 30 years now. Um been with Castle or Community Action Agency of St. Louis County. That's our our legal name, but Castle is what our

0:37friends call us. So, um you're certainly welcome to call us Castle. I've been here about three and a half years and I was prior to joining this team, I was with our local county government. So, we were doing a bit of the same work and working in partnership with Castle, but I officially joined this team in March of 2023. Um, and I tell you, it's been an absolute pleasure. >> And so for people who don't know Castle, like because you do a bunch of different stuff. I've been to your offices, you know, you got plenty of people, plenty of stuff going on. Just talk to people about the types of programs you run and

1:10the types of people you're trying to help. >> So Castle is the wonderful part about our agency is we have 26 programs. However, every 3 years, we're able to take a community needs assessment and based on what the community tells us they'd like for us to see or what they'd like us to provide, then we're able to provide those services to them. Everything that um our whole foundation and our reason for existing is based on stabilization. So, if families need that one-time assistance, such as utility assistance through our LA Heat program, which is the low-income housing energy assistance program or the food pantry

1:45because food instability is always a challenge, or they need more long-term support. Say they're returning because they're just as involved and they've served their time, but everybody needs a second chance, but you would need somebody to help you kind of navigate what that looks like. So, do you need um substance use classes or do you need anger management or do you need a case manager to help you find justice friendly employers so that the struggle to reintegrate into society isn't so difficult. So, we we run the gamut of those services but at our core it's always family stabilization. So, there

2:15is um GE classes or highet which is what they're called now. Also, we do um step up to leadership classes. That's for community members that are interested in becoming engaged or giving back, but they aren't quite sure where to start. So, we have those classes. It's 12 weeks. We introduce you to um the foundations of leadership such as Robert's rules of order, so that you know the rules of the game when you come to community meetings, but also a little bit about yourself so that you're not as intimidated about what some of those boards or what um community meetings. It can sound intimidating if you're not

2:47familiar, but once you kind of know a little bit about yourself and and the rules that you're going to be asked to abide by, it makes that transition far more easier. >> For sure. And so what I'd love to talk to you about is a little bit about, you know, Missouri, St. Louis, you know, the area you work in. So tell people about it, like what are the challenges? What's it like? You know, what are the things that maybe a little bit more unique about where you're based and the challenges you're you're fixing or trying to fix? So the challenge for St. Louis County um the area that we cover um the geography it's it's about 700

3:19square miles for starters. Um we're kind of centrally located in a in a central county called Overland. Um but what you'll see at at the polar opposite ends of the county, both north and south, you have pockets of extreme poverty. And so there's where we see our greatest need for services. Um but you know, brick and mortar buildings can be quite expensive. So what we found is the easiest way for us to cover our entire 700 square miles is through collaborative partnerships with uh community partners such as libraries. Every community always has a library and based on the applications or the inquiries that we receive. We then

3:54are able to partner with the library in their area so that we can pro, you know, remove the barrier of transportation because public transportation can be a barrier for some of our folks either because of the time constraints to getting from place to to place or just if you don't have child care or some of many of the barriers that people find themselves with as it relates to getting to a single location for services. So, we go out to where the need is and we make sure that we're available to meet them there to collect documents or to turn in or to help them complete applications if that's a challenge

4:25because that helps us um just kind of navigate in addition to the transportation. Sometimes you have the barrier of just the digital divide. Not everybody has access to telephones or computers or laptops, things that we readily, you know, tell people go online and do this. Well, that's a difficult ask if you don't have access. So, we're attempting to remove those barriers, which is the greatest thing that we see as a challenge for folks that need our services. The other thing is promotion. Um, you know, we don't spend a lot of money on marketing to give away money. So, we try to use those tools that

4:57people are familiar with, which is word of mouth, social media. Um, every now and then we get news coverage or we certainly have the honor of being invited to join podcasts like this that'll help spread the word about the work that we do. >> Yeah. And one of the things that I loved when I came to see you and then, you know, hopefully when I see the team again in St. Louis in uh in September is, you know, there's a real attention to trying to understand the clients and try and meet them where they're at. And so just talk to me about like maybe some of the youth and young adults you're you're working with. What are the

5:30challenges they're facing and what are the things that you think make a difference in terms of, you know, getting their first job or, you know, getting out of a substance abuse challenge? What are the things? How do you think about that? >> I think the first thing we try to keep in mind is these are all individuals. There's no monolithic you. There is no typical family or everybody's challenge is just a little bit different. So instead of me trying to assume how I think I you should be served or what I think your family best needs, we try to ask and then see where you are and then meet you where you are. Cuz again, some

6:01people I just need to help them navigate finding a job or some people I need to help them figure out how can I get banked. Um cuz even though again those are things that sometimes we take for granted but that's a big deal. If nobody in your family has a bank account when I do help you get a job then you have the difficulty of where to cash your check. Do you have to go to a local store? Do you have to go someplace where there's predatory banking practices that are going to take a great percentage of your income or if you get it on a card and it's not insured? What happens if you lose the card or if there's fraudulent

6:29activity? So those are things that we just kind of navigate because those are the this new world that we live in in terms of youth. And so those are some of the challenges that they face. Um and in one particular instance, we even partner with an employer and we're exploring how can we establish banking um accounts for people that are under 18 because they have a large percentage of youth that are employed there and many of their parents don't have bank accounts for some reason. And so we're just exploring what that might look like for them, how we can help them navigate that, and how you can introduce it to them earlier

7:00because again, sometimes you only know what you've been exposed to. And so we want to have those conversations, do it in plain English so that people aren't afraid to ask those questions that maybe they don't know and don't know where to safely ask or they're embarrassed to ask. Um, so we just kind of start there. Depends on where you are and and let's figure out what you're looking for. and then I want to make sure that you're involved. It it's self-determined. You can reach out if you need the help, but if you don't need the help, you don't have to come here every day. Um, but we just kind of develop a plan that is

7:32centralized around the client and their needs. >> Yeah. And one of the things I found super interesting recently is um when I was talking to Scott Schubert, who you know as part of our team, and he used to be an executive director up in Washington DC, he was talking about how the best case managers almost perform like a wraparound service. So it's like, you know, we're we're helping with this, we're helping with this, we're helping with this, and together that can help someone make progress, but also progress for that person may be, you know, just sending an application for an interview or it might be, you know, going to the

8:02bank or it might be so you've got to build those things up. So is that kind of what you're talking about about meeting people where they are? >> Yes. And sometimes it's a warm handoff. One of the other things that I think that we found is that since the pandemic, people are more readily willing to admit that maybe they struggle with challenges around mental health. You mentioned our youth. Well, there is a greater number of youth who experience loneliness or they talk about depression or not feeling connected. Electronics have been great, but they've also disconnected us from our peer groups. Or, you know, I'm just old

8:32enough that we could have an embarrassing moment and only people in your class and your school know about it. Well, now that embarrassing moment can go viral. So, one of the other things that we've noticed and and we've worked really hard to develop our partnership so that we can hand you off to a maybe a partner that that's their expertise. We're not the experts on mental health. However, we can do a warm handoff to a mental health provider so that you can comfortably be seen and not have to go through a lot of red tape or have difficulty navigating insurance or finding out if you're eligible. So,

9:01those are some of the things that I think we're uniquely positioned to provide. It's a great service, but you also can recognize you can't be all things to all people, and that's where partnerships become so critical. >> Sure. What's the most frustrating thing about your job? >> I think the most frustrating part about my job is there's probably more need than I have resources to provide. >> Um, but I think it's also the greatest source of joy because even when I can't do it with mine, I usually can find a way to get it done through somebody else. So, it's my greatest frustration, but it's also becomes my greatest

9:36challenge that I'm like, "Okay, we can do this. I'm this close and I'm not going to accept no and so we can figure out a way to do it." But yeah, that can be my greatest challenge is when you find those folks that maybe they don't qualify for services here for some reason, and I haven't identified the source someplace else, but but we get it worked out. >> Yeah. What about um where do how do you think about uh like if you could wave a magic wand, what would you what would you change about you know some of the programs or eligibility or the bureaucracy? What are the things that you'd be like this would make the

10:08biggest difference if we changed it? >> Uh sometimes things don't move as fast as I like for them to move. I think that we see need or we see uh trends, you know, where the where the challenge lies before the funding sometimes catches up. So because you're the frontline folks and I think that probably is something that is experienced at all the caps or at all social service providers quite honestly is sometimes there's a disconnect between the people on the ground and the people that are here making the decisions and who determine eligibility. >> Right. What what are you seeing right now then? What's the what's the shifts

10:41that are happening in St. Louis that you're seeing that maybe weren't happening a year two years ago? probably um is around housing because I think that the the single most important thing that we can provide people with is adequate housing or that they can be stabilized through their housing. As we see the shift towards um less affordable housing, then it becomes more and more challenging for me to find either affordable housing for people to rent and or those that typically were able to buy their first home. some of the the prices have priced those folks out and they're having to be renters far longer

11:16and and then the rent is not affordable on the amount of income that they currently have. So, and I think that that makes it difficult because every service that we provide um or any support or wraparound service is far easier when someone has a stable place to call home every night. So, I think that that's our biggest challenge. So, we work real hard to around homeless prevention so that we can stop the flow into homelessness because it's far difficult to get you back in housing if you lose your housing. Um, but I would say the expense around housing has been our biggest challenge. >> Yeah, I agree. And the um there's a

11:50really interesting study, I don't know if you've seen it, if you haven't, I'll send it to you afterwards. It's with in LA County where they were essentially building an algorithm to predict which people were most likely to become homeless. and and then you know the idea was well we can give them a smaller amount of funds than we would if they became homeless and therefore try and try and do that as a as a thing. I think from a technology standpoint it's really interesting. I think from a human standpoint it's maybe a little bit harder because do you want to call someone say hey you're having a you know

12:19I think you might be you know it's it's interesting right so like I think I think that level of prevention is clearly everyone talks about it but I I feel like there's not enough effort in trying to identify or the fund or the smaller funds to try and stop it >> you know that was one of the so prior to joining this team I was still at the county during the pandemic and one of the things we were able to do was that very thing is we could look at um both by neighborhood and both by landlord or based on where the person was living typically like who was u more likely to do mass filings or where evictions were

12:53likely being reported from by just a particular zip code. So we although we didn't single out individuals, we did make a conscientious effort to go to that particular complex or that area and just say, "Hey, if you think that you're experiencing any of these things, please reach out because there are resources available." And so I think for all the terrible things that happened during the pandemic, there were a few times that that crisis allowed us to do some really innovative things. So you are right that was very helpful to be able to do some prevention that was almost in real time versus most of the time we are chasing

13:27you know the crisis instead of getting in front of it. So um you are absolutely right. I I dream of the day. So back to my wand. If I could wave a wand that would be it. It's almost like the that old movie they had where they could predict the future and then go in and um and kind of stop the crime before it happens. Minority report. So if I could do that. >> Yeah. Yeah. Mr. Mr. Tom Cruz. Mr. Tom Cruz. Right. >> Yeah. That's it's one of my favorite novels as well. It's based on an a good novel. But I I think it's a I think it's one of those things where and maybe this brings on to the next bit which is

14:03around kind of technology but also social work and humanity, right? Because I know when we met that's kind of one of the things we talked about, right? And just because you've got a predictive engine doesn't mean you can help someone change or you need to intervene in the right way. So, I know you're interested in technology and you guys use it a lot. Like, tell me how you think about it while also kind of maintaining that if you're going to help people in a crisis, you need to be probably at least face to face or over the phone or something. >> Sure. Well, first of all, I think that um sometimes we're the last in in this

14:34industry to embrace technology because we are so such proponents of that human touch. However, I do think that technology is a tool and and before we started talking, we talked about it being a tool that could help us be more efficient because there's some parts of the services that we provide that aren't adding any value. Like for me answering the phone to tell you where your application is, if technology could provide you that and that's all you wanted that day, then it'd be okay for the computer to be able to get your information and then look you up. That would be great. versus if you're truly

15:06in crisis and like you need medication or you need something else that only a human could help you navigate, then you'd be able to get to that human and that would be the best use because the person that wants a short answer isn't on hold waiting on me to finish or manage the crisis. Um, but the person that's in crisis isn't on hold while I'm doing these routine things. So I think when we can find that wonderful balance of doing the human versus the um the automated I think that will be great because there's a whole segment of people that have no I they have no desire to talk to a human by the converse you know there there is a group

15:40of folks that would come in here and they're like okay I don't want to talk to Linda how do you get away from Linda and just answer my question and hang up. So, I think when we can find a partnership or find um the way to integrate that safely and humanely, I think that will be a wonderful day. Um and I think we'll get there because we're having conversations with people who understand the work, who are passionate about our work, um but also, you know, are aware of what we're trying to do. So, I think if we keep having conversations like this, we'll get there and we'll get there much faster >> for sure. And just lastly, I know the

16:13annual conference for community action is in St. Lewis this year. So for people who are thinking about coming or you know going to be there, what can they look forward to? >> They can look forward to community action representation from all across the country. Um you'll never find a more larger group of people that all want to care and and take care of each other and the community. So it's a great opportunity to exchange ideas, best practices. Um we're also going to have some things we call a poverty assimilation. So that's for people who aren't familiar with the work that we do. you get a chance to kind of walk

16:45through the shoes of the people that we serve because often people think they know, but you have no idea sometimes the resilience and the the courage that it takes to simply keep getting up every day when you're not certain of where you're going to live or how you're going to pay your bills or how even to meet your family's basic needs, but they find a way to do it. And so poverty assimilations do that. I think they can help us change the way we view each other and they help us drill down to the humanity because at the end we all want the same thing and that's life and the ability to take care of ourselves to our

17:15our highest level of self-sufficiency and and to just be happy. So I think that you'll come down and and that'll be the experience that we're hoping to give them. Plus, they'll get to see the great sites and the the things that St. Louis has to offer. Free zoos, the arch, you know, it's it's a great time. >> Amazing museum. Amazing. Yeah. with with an with one of my favorite paintings ever. Yeah, it's beautiful. Beautiful. >> Yeah, but Linda, thanks so much. Really appreciate you coming on the podcast and um looking forward to seeing you in September. >> Thank you for having me. And yes, I am looking forward to seeing you in

17:48September. And in the meantime, if there's anything that we can do for you, please give us a call. We're here. >> We will. >> Thank you.